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After Snapefen, here come Ronfen!!

 
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Wildflower



Joined: 03 Mar 2005
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Location: Shuttling between France and the US

PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:27 pm    Post subject: After Snapefen, here come Ronfen!! Reply with quote

I discovered recently that Ron Weasley has gathered a following as fanatical and as irrational as Snape's!!! Eek

Have a look at this: Ronald Bilius Weasley

Now don't get me wrong, I like Ron. But depicting him as a misunderstood, under-estimated character, looked-down upon by his family and his best friends, one who has to work twice as hard for half the recognition that Harry gets (yes, I know, that's what they say about women), that's going too far!

I posted the link to page 43, but the debate started way before that, and went on after that, so heated that there were threats of bans, and even actual bannings!! (Those CoS Mods will never change, to the bitter end!)

A little aside re: Snape: While looking through the thread, I happened to find a signature showing Snape holding Lily's dead body with the caption "The Boy Who Loved". As if Snape was the only character who loved (and he didn't even love well, imo) - it almost made me lose my dinner.
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inkling7



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PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:39 pm    Post subject: Why bother? Reply with quote

Why go into the site and look at those threads if it makes you feel like throwing up so much? Ah well it will all be over in a month or so and you can feel better..LOL super grin
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Wildflower



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PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Why bother? Reply with quote

inkling7 wrote:
Why go into the site and look at those threads if it makes you feel like throwing up so much? Ah well it will all be over in a month or so and you can feel better..LOL super grin

Well, someone in the Google Group mentioned it and I was curious to see what the fuss about Ron was about. I hadn't expected to come across that emetic Snapefen siggie. super grin

It also amused me that at one point, Melaszka scolded the posters for talking about Harry more than about Ron in the Ron thread. Off-topicness being a capital crime on CoS. Rolling Eyes I also happen to know at least one person was banned from Legilimency Studies for their posts about Ron. And, as Inkling and someone else said, they're wondering why the site is going down the drain!bleh
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Griffiegirl



Joined: 17 Mar 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:58 pm    Post subject: Re: After Snapefen, here come Ronfen!! Reply with quote

Wildflower wrote:
Now don't get me wrong, I like Ron. But depicting him as a misunderstood, under-estimated character, looked-down upon by his family and his best friends, one who has to work twice as hard for half the recognition that Harry gets (yes, I know, that's what they say about women), that's going too far!

I went to look for myself and saw what you mean. To wit, this exchange:


Quote:
Personally I don't see how popularity enters into a discussion on character analysis, particularly in the age group were talking about here, from 11 to 17. But Ron did have friends (in addition to Harry & Hermione) and seemed to be well regarded by them and was not ignored.

I'm just saying that Ron's brothers all seem to have widespread respect, despite the fact that Ron himself has been part of far more adventures and famous things than all of them put together. Yet no one has the same regard for Ron, including his own family.


Quote:
I think you're ignoring the source of Ron's insecurity, which is his own inner dialog from an early age. Growing up, when Ron saw what his brothers accomplished at Hogwarts or beyond, there would likely be an initial reaction of awe, then perhaps a desire to do the same when he grew up, and then a bit of wondering if he'd be able to measure up.

Being respected and appreciated by other folks enters into it as well. Like I said, Ron goes through more than his brothers all put together yet he is not appreciated for this, even by his own family. They treat him the same as they've always treated him, which doesn't help his self-esteem any.

A person's self-image, especially when as young as Ron, is affected quite a bit by how everyone else sees them. That he rarely got any appreciation and respect from anyone (heck, I don't even think Harry and Hermione really appreciated him as much as they should) was a major source of his insecurity. Especially when his brothers, who went through less, got more respect and love than him.
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inkling7



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PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 1:42 am    Post subject: The Weasleys Reply with quote

I think that by the time they had five sons they were really hoping Ron would be a girl and were disappointed when they had yet another son. Notice that when they finally had a girl they stopped having children. Ron must have been aware of this and I bet Fred and George without meaning to be unkind and not realising how Ron would feel teased him about not being the girl his parents hoped for.....

Poor old Ron didn't have the book learning that Hermione had nor the fame of Harry so probably sometimes felt left out of the trio and the close friendship Harry and Hermione had and felt that Hermione would prefer Harry over him - when she didn't - she was attracted to Ron and treated Harry more like the brother she never had...

So I can actually see where the Ronfens were sort of coming from but I must admit I didn't read any of the thread so may be wrong.

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Proud Puff



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PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 2:18 pm    Post subject: The Boy Who Loved? Reply with quote

Wildflower wrote:
A little aside re: Snape: While looking through the thread, I happened to find a signature showing Snape holding Lily's dead body with the caption "The Boy Who Loved". As if Snape was the only character who loved (and he didn't even love well, imo) - it almost made me lose my dinner.

Gag me with a spoon!! Eek

Has it escaped the owner of that signature that the only person incapable of love in the series is Voldie himself? Though to be honest I'm not too sure that Tom Riddle the Elder was capable of real love himself, with or without a love potion. The picture is obviously from the movie, that scene was never in the book. Snape was NOT in Godric's Hollow that fateful night. AND I actually doubt Snape was really capable of real, selfless love. His love for Lily is all about him, not her.

Back to Ron, the movies also did Ron a big disservice the way they portrayed him. Still, he never was whining. He did leave the other two in DH, but he was under the influence of the locket. And he did come back of his own volition.

He's neither a victim or act like one, not in the books.
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Strawberry07



Joined: 06 Jun 2011
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PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2013 5:53 am    Post subject: Re: The Boy Who Loved? Reply with quote

Proud Puff wrote:
Has it escaped the owner of that signature that the only person incapable of love in the series is Voldie himself?


A little insignificant detail like that doesn't matter to Snapefen.They seem to think that the greatest love, the most important love in the series, was Snape's "love" for Lily, tot he extent that they degrade all other love, including the relationships Lily chose, and Lily's love for her son. Oh yes, he loved her so much, he would have been delighted if she'd suffered the anguish of losing her son and husband. Rolling Eyes Restraining order, anyone?


Quote:
Though to be honest I'm not too sure that Tom Riddle the Elder was capable of real love himself, with or without a love potion.


Off-topic, but I don't think we know enough about Riddle Sr. to say that. He may have loved the girl he was horse-riding with; he may have loved his parents. He did not love the woman who abducted him and forced him into a relationship. Hardly surprising, IMO. He got away when he could, as any kidnap victim would.

Quote:
The picture is obviously from the movie, that scene was never in the book. Snape was NOT in Godric's Hollow that fateful night. AND I actually doubt Snape was really capable of real, selfless love. His love for Lily is all about him, not her.


I agree, I think it was an incredibly creepy scene.

Quote:
Back to Ron, the movies also did Ron a big disservice the way they portrayed him. Still, he never was whining. He did leave the other two in DH, but he was under the influence of the locket. And he did come back of his own volition.

He's neither a victim or act like one, not in the books.


Yeah, I really, really dislike what the movies did to Ron's character, and the trio dynamic. Puts me off the movies completely, as one of my favourite things in the books is the friendship of the trio.

Ron, in the books, is not the put-upon, martyr that these Ronfen make him out to be. Just like with the Snapefen, it seems to be a major case of projecting and over-identifying with the character. Just with none of the character's good points. In the books, Ron has insecurities and makes mistakes, just as other characters do. Ron learns from his mistakes and grows up. Doesn't seem like the fen have learned how to do that.

I think, though, that I see something that the Ron-fen and Ron-bashers have in common. I think they both take issue with the fact that Ron is the most normal member of the trio. He doesn't stand out as Harry and Hermione do. For the Ron-bashers, he's unworthy of their attention because he's too "ordinary", whereas for the Ron-fen, it's taken as an insult that he's so "ordinary". (Even though I have to wonder how many "ordinary" teenagers would do what Ron did in the Shrieking Shack, and on other occasions. Rolling Eyes
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Oerba Dia Vanille
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Joined: 15 Apr 2013
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 12:09 pm    Post subject: Ron Weasley Reply with quote

I agree with Strawberry- Ron is most definitely the most normal- like Xander in Buffy- he said something to Dawn along the lines of "sometimes it's difficult being the normal one" (paraphrased)

I like Ron- in the book he provided the comic relief, but in the later films he was boosted to the clown. I liked Rupert Grint as Ron, he was working with the script he was given, but I still think he gave an essence of Ron at times...yes, the Ron character in the book was different to the Ron in the film, but I can't help but think that Rupert Grint would have played a better Ron had he been given a more faithful script. It's difficult, because in the first two films, Rupert played Ron brilliantly, but he seemed to veer away from Ron in the films. I can only blame this on the script, because I think he played Ron as close to bookRon as he could in the first couple of films.

I am a fan of Ron, because he's the guy who isn't afraid to make quips...but he has his flaws, as does Harry, Hermione...sod it, every "good" character in the series. And I think that's my favourite thing about the whole story. Every good character has flaws. And it makes them more human. I dislike a story where the main characters are inherently good, with no flaws, and good looking to boot. Even if they aren't good looking, they are still so good they wouldn't do anything that was bad. Even their falling in love isn't bad, even if they fall in love with complete *ahem* juicestains. Because they are so "good." I hate a story like that. And the story of Harry Potter is not like that at all, in my opinion. I love the fact that they make mistakes. I love the fact that they can go off on one.
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